DISCUSSION: Weight Loss Surgery

[Cholette 0]

I overheard a group of ladies talking, during our fellowship at church at the next table, and their discussion was interesting. There were a couple of the ladies who had weight issues and seemed to be very down about it and said that they were going to be looking into weight loss surgery. At first the conversation was mild and seemed to be something that both ladies were going to definately do, but then another lady, who was sitting quietly at the same table spoke up. She asked, "Do you think God wants you to modify the way your body functions just so you can lose weight?" She went on to say that God had given both of them the power and the self control to eat moderately to lose weight.

This discussion became a little animated because neither woman wanted to be "called to the carpet" about not having self control. My heart ached because anyone that knows me, I've ALWAYS had a soft spot in my heart for overweight women. I'm not sure where that has come from since I've not had to deal with weight issues, but I wanted to see what your opinions are regarding this topic. If you have scriptural references, please include that as well.

I know God is calling me to minister to women like these two...I just know it. I've had some very personal conversations with a couple of close friends and after praying with them and allowing the Lord to minister through me, to them, they both have walked in their victory. One has lost close to 60 pounds and the other about 35 pounds. I've never had this topic of weight loss surgery come up, so I'm going to prayerfully consider your comments here and do my own study/research in the Word.

Thank you!

PS...if you have personal experience with this...let me know that as well!!!

[dreamster 0]

i kno im notta but its notta genda issue ,,this is a huge topik, [pun intended ,,],, ther r few issues involved, 1 societys expectation/value of a person relative 2 ther size,, personal heath,,,personal worth, its mi humble opinion that, overweight ppl problem is either;1/ lifestyle based, eg; type of food eaten exercise dun ,, or 2/ state of mind ,, eating 2 fill a void or cover a hurt in ones life, ,3/ a medikal condition,, causing excess wieght gain, i dont hav the answers ,, ,, i know ovaweight ppl r discrimnated against ,,devalued,, ridikuled, abused, overlooked, etc, ,, unless ur an opera star or sumthing, i guess the topik of surgery is dwn2 personal choice, sum beleavers hav cosmetik surgery, ,,,of various types, i guess we hav dominion ova our bodys,, look at ivf 2 hav babys, often its the thin ppl who call 2 carpet, i knowa pasta who did that ,, he had no sympathy 4 anyone who was carrying extra pounds,, he was quite proud of his trimness, he got on mi case once ,,i wantd prayer 4 sum health issues he lookd dwn on me an scowled at me sayin god dont heal wen ur the person at fault, i didnt want his prayers or his judgement ,, i was deeply hurt, an felt his discrimination an pride was more of a problem than mi pounds, 2 try 2 answer ur question C,,, um we hav free will, i guess its up2 each persons conscionce,, sum ppl rnt gonna get ther thru diet an exercise, thers a risk wiv obeseity surgery, ,, but if it helps them well an good, but it doesnt answer the primery question of why the ppl r overweight in first place,, and will they need the procedure again, ,,im sure this will be a lively topik inDeed i hav herd of ppl gettg instant supernatural wieghtloss, 30-50lbs, ,,, D,,

[Dove-Solutions 0]

Cholette,

I find this to be an important topic. I believe we have the right to choose what we do with our bodies, but I think the real question is, does God want us to do it. I think that has to be determined on the person and their situation. Is it medically necessary vs just the desire to do it. I have struggled with my weight for a few years now and no matter how much I excercise or watch my food intake I gain. So I have no idea what is going on there but I understand the frustration that comes from comments people make to others about their weight. I agree that some can be controlled by discipline and excercise but I know that will not apply to all. I for one have considered the option of some type of surgery but have made the personal choice not to. Like dreamster I have heard of cases during deliverance ministry where people have shed 30-60 pounds. So I do believe the Lord can help us in quest to loose weight but I believe that for this to happen there can be other factors involved, ie: forgiveness issues, etc. Great subject. One thing to add here is this:

Take heart that all are loved by God. He does not care if you are short, fat, skinny, stripped with pink polka dots....you are loved. To him you are perfect just the way you are. The real question is do we love ourselves just the way we are and do we know his love for us never falters because we do not meet mans expectation of how we should look. How boring life would be if we were all the same height, weight, intelligence, etc. God made us different for a reason. God loves us no matter what and I for one hold on to that.

Love in Jesus,

Connie

[Cholette 0]

OH YES!!! The two of you have hit some KEY points. Before I respond, I will wait to see if anyone else has anything more to add.

Good stuff D and Connie...

[Linda Irish 0]

I know that I have a medical problem called "Hoshimotos disease" its an underactive thyroid ~so the average person my size should be able to eat 1200 or even 1400 calories a day and maintain weight. I have no control over that, I did have some control for years as I was on a thyroid medication to help my body do what it is suppose to do. I have been without insurance for almost 18 months now and over the 18 months gained twenty pounds.

Even with the fact that I have a disorder, I know there is a word in the Bible that NO ONE wants to hear. It is not politically correct among even the born again Christians and yet I feel God is bringing this to my attention. I know I wont be well recieved by sharing but I want you all to pray about this because God has been laying this on my heart. The Bible tells us of the sin of gluttony.

Its not swearing, or murder, or violence against our fellowman and yet that word and its meaning is shunned by all. I feel like God is saying to me, "If you can be faithful in the small things then maybe you can be faithful in the bigger things" This sin is looked at as a non issue. Like it is not a sin, but it is just like any sin. If we realize that it is not glorifying God we need to pray about it and ask for help. (Does is glorify God that I will die early, that I cant run and play with my grandchildren, that I am creating more physical problems for myself...maybe even to the point of disability??" No...satan has us all hood winkled...as we get more and more disatisfied and disabled from lack of self control on yummy food..., but what is that doing to our spiritual life? "Self discipline" is needed to follow Christ, truly. Having self discipline in eating a healthy way is a good way to practice dying to self and learning to make the right choices. I am not talking about legalism I am talking about the self discipline it takes to earnestly follow the leading of the Holy Spirit. It is the ones who do the will of God that are the children of God, but it is the one who follows the leading of the Holy Spirit that are the sons of God.
This is not a popular take on over eating or over weight...it is not to make anyone feel bad...but it is to inspire us all to seek the truth...what God wants us to see. Not the popular take on the issues of the day. This is stuff God has been showing me the last few days.

I just lost a pound and a half in the last two weeks by plodding away at this whole thing....I really need to depend on God to show me in a real way what all this means and how it applies to my life in Christ. I am going to post some of my low cal goodies that I have been discovering !!!!!! Sorry this is so long. God bless all.

Instead of believing "poor me" because "the rest of the world can eat more food than me...thats not fair" I am beginning to see that for whatever reason over indulgence is a sin...it is, and I need to turn it over to God like any sin, confess my part and ask for help.

[Dove-Solutions 0]

I understand and agree Linda. I will definatley be praying about that.

Love in Jesus,

Connie

[Cholette 0]

Oh Miss Linda...you are preaching girl. Once again, you have hit something that I minister to women as well. I say women, because that's who God has called me to, but we know that men have the same issues.

No one is going to get upset with you because this is THE WORD and 'Gluttony' is mentioned in the word of God. The one thing we need to balance out is what Connie mentioned...that God still loves us, despite our sins. If we lack control in the eating department, we are still God's beloved. I really believe that the lack of control in THIS AREA (outside of medical issues) could be not having a true understanding of how much God loves us in the moments of temptation.

I don't want to get going on this, because I can...I just wanted to encourage you Miss Linda that no one will get upset with you...the Word is the Word...Truth is truth! Thanks for sharing this.

[dreamster 0]

i agree in principal,,,, ohh is that fried chiken? yummy,, um yep id love sum buiscuts an gravy ,, i think gluttony is a branch from the tree of greed,, ,,the werd says put the axe 2 the root, ,,, [im hopeing 4 lotsa credits 4 that scrip ],, the werld appludes greed ,,, it dont matta how u get it,, jus as long as u do,, ,, i think adictions hav many faces,, etc,, u dont know until that button gets pushed ,, wat hold it has in ur life,, ,, howeva i dont beleave wer r 2 whip ourselves like monks, cos he gives us all things 2 richly enjoy,, D,,,

[Linda Irish 0]

Your posts made me feel so loved, Cholette, Connie and the big "D"~ thanks.

Yes our Dad so loves us....but you have to admit say the word "gluttony" and people freak out.

I know that when I, or anyone else is hurting...the opposite of pain is pleasure and it may only be a nice plate full of grandmas potatoe salad....but still it brings pleasure...

I am workin on it....(smile). love you guys....

[dreamster 0]

,,, um wood u like 2 upsize that miss,,?? ,, um extra chickn wiv mommas tato salad, ,,um an coke zero 4 the drink ?? ok that;ll be $14;95, hava nice day ,, call again soon, ,,,, D at the drive thru,,

[Dove-Solutions 0]

Your not helping D.

[dreamster 0]

i know,, its watt i do best,,,, D,,, burgaking,,

[Linda Irish 0]

I would bet that when D was little he spent a great deal of time standing in the corner. (what are we going to do with him?)

[dreamster 0]

spoiling werks best, D

[lola21st 2]

I agree with everyone! This is an issue near and dear to me as well because I'm in the midst of losing weight and have dealt with weight issues for most of my life whether at an appropriate weight or overweight.

First, I completely agree with Connie - the foundation here is that God loves us no matter what our physical form so nobody should be judged because of their weight. Having said that I don't think that obesity is God's best for us, nor do I think that striving to be a size 0 when your body is meant to be a size 14 is God’s best either. The related health issues caused or exacerbated by obesity can't be overlooked, especially when we look at obesity rates in the US over the last 30 years. Society increasingly attempts to simplify the problem as one of overindulgence and not exercising. But this is a tangled web, obesity is a multi-faceted issue.

Our diets have changed over time to include more processed foods than real/whole foods. Chemically derived ingredients, i.e., high fructose corn syrup, trans fats, GMO foods, etc. have increasingly become part of most baked goods, juices, sauces, cereals, etc. These chemicals wreak havoc on our metabolism (ultimately resulting in weight gain) and on our organs – liver, kidneys, heart, etc. The increase in weight then gives us an increased risk of developing diabetes, high blood pressure, cancer, heart disease, etc. Google high fructose corn syrup and hydrogenated fats to get a better sense of the extent of the damage that these two ingredients alone do to the body or go to www.mercola.com and search these terms on the website.

Activity wise, our lifestyles have become more sedentary. I remember when I was a kid we used to take the bus and walk a lot more, kids used to play outside, families used to go to the park. These days most of our days are spent commuting between home and work and we’re so overworked that we’re too tired to exercise and we drive to most places even when we really could walk. We have to kick our kids out of the house to play because they’d rather play on their video games or computers or ipads or phones so the rate of childhood obesity has increased.

Society’s morals have declined over the years so that an increasing number of people grew up having experienced (or still experience) some sin that is committed against them – verbal/physical/sexual abuse, poor living conditions, non-supportive, isolated home environment, lived in a home where substance abuse was an issue, etc. – And the result is often that food is used as a coping mechanism. I can’t count the number of obese women I know who were sexually abused as a child and admittedly use food as a comforter and protector. Other times the dysfunctional behavior might not be as dire as what I just described but overeating is still used as a coping mechanism to deal with anger, frustration, stress, depression, etc., some people emotionally eat rather than address their emotions or handle them in an emotionally/physically more healthy manner.

There are a myriad of reasons why people are overweight but the bottom line is that obesity is a far more complicated issue than just overeating and under-exercising and each individual’s story of how it is that they are or became obese is very different so that there’s no blanket solution.

IMO, a sustained weight loss is based on a combination of spiritual, emotional, and physical healing as well as education about food and fitness, and a strong resolve/commitment (powered by the Holy Spirit) to develop and maintain healthy habits – this combination is going to differ from person to person. For me personally, I was overweight as a child, but slimmed down during high school and college. Interestingly, when I was in my 20’s I thought I was heavy based on what the scale said but I was a size 10 – I would love to be a size 10 now…. I gained weight after I quit smoking in 2000 and again after I had my second son (I gained 45 lbs during the pregnancy, had the baby and the scale didn’t notice even after 6 months of breastfeeding which is supposed to make you lose the baby weight…ha! ) and I have battled it ever since. I decided this year that I was going to deal with this once and for all and except for the last month or so I’ve been pretty successful in doing so. I was inspired by my cousin who lost 45 lbs in 4 months and, after learning more about the protocol that she did, I did the same and lost 25 lbs over a two month period. (This program isn’t for everyone but I’m leaving the website should anyone want to learn more: www.yourhcg.com and www.facebook.com/yourhcg . )

I developed a face of flint and had to face my diet demons in order to be successful and lose my excess weight. On the other hand, this diet worked for me because one fruit of the Spirit (patience) has a huge opportunity for growth in my life…. I’m not going to lie, seeing immediate and significant results made all of the difference in this being a success for me. My challenge isn’t that I don’t know what to do as far as nutrition and fitness goes, the challenge for me was losing weight at a pace that would keep me engaged. on previous diets, I'd stay on the diet, work out like nobody's business and then only lose .7 lbs for the week. The hcg protocol is strict and the only way that I could’ve made it was through the diet is with God’s grace, love, and encouragement. I found the following scriptures helped me a great deal as I faced temptations and needed a refreshing to get through the day.


Matthew 6:25 (I know that this verse is about not worrying, but it also had meaning for me as one who is an emotional eater and the second part of the verse always pierces my spirit – my life shouldn’t revolve around food, food shouldn’t be an idol in my life….)
Therefore I say to you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or what you will drink; nor about your body, what you will put on. Is not life more than food and the body more than clothing

1 Corinthians 6:19-20 (note: this scripture was specifically addressing sexual immorality but I personally think that excess eating is a sin against the body as well)
19 Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? 20 For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God’s.

Philippians 4:13
I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

Luke 22 (what I was reminded of in this passage is that we should always be prayed up when we know we’re entering a period of temptation – e.g., going to that party/gathering where there’ll be plenty of food that I have no business eating and certainly don’t have to overindulge in it if I do decide to eat)

The Prayer in the Garden

39 Coming out, He went to the Mount of Olives, as He was accustomed, and His disciples also followed Him. 40 When He came to the place, He said to them, “Pray that you may not enter into temptation.” 41 And He was withdrawn from them about a stone’s throw, and He knelt down and prayed, 42 saying, “Father, if it is Your will, take this cup away from Me; nevertheless not My will, but Yours, be done.” 43 Then an angel appeared to Him from heaven, strengthening Him. 44 And being in agony, He prayed more earnestly. Then His sweat became like great drops of blood falling down to the ground.[e]
45 When He rose up from prayer, and had come to His disciples, He found them sleeping from sorrow. 46 Then He said to them, “Why do you sleep? Rise and pray, lest you enter into temptation.”

1 Corinthians 10:13
No temptation has overtaken you except such as is common to man; but God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will also make the way of escape, that you may be able to bear it.

James 1:7
Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.

John 10:10 (for me, having my health is key to having an abundant life )
The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly.

[dreamster 0]

well that wasa mouthful, ,,um good points raised ther lurds, ive seen a direct link wiv poverty an poor diet health problems,, ppl r no longa liveing,, ther surviving an many cant afford good basiks, its heart breaking becos its become a generational health epidemik in the land of D,,, so its a many faceted thing, i think surgery shood be a last resort, 2 answer Cholettes question, ,,,,,,,, D,, oh waita,,, menu plse,,,

[Dove-Solutions 0]

Well said Lurdys!

[Linda Irish 0]

Wonderful....loved it.

[lola21st 2]

Sorry, sometimes I feel like a prose volcano - the words just spew out and I can't stop....

Same thing is happening here in the States - the cost of good, healthy organic food can be prohibitive and it's hard to afford. Much easier and way cheaper to buy the bad food...You're right, I didn't specifically answer Cholette's question. Surgery should be an absolute last resort because that's disrupting the natural function of God's temple. Surgery is serious business, "they" position it as a simple, straightforward thing and it's not, more problems can be created through the same surgery. Also, life post-surgery is plain unpleasant - you basically can't eat except for extremely small portions and there are some foods that you'll never be able to eat again.

Which leads to the other consideration that is often overlooked - unless the spiritual/emotional/physical issues that led to the obesity are dealt with, the weight WILL return despite the surgery. While on this protocol, I met several women on the FB page who had the surgery but gained the weight back - it didn't occur to me that regaining the weight was even a possibility until I met this group. Given this risk, I would really urge people to explore and try ALL other options (at least twice) before moving forward with the surgery.

Connie and Linda - thanks!

[dreamster 0]

rnt u 4gettg sumone,,

[lola21st 2]

I don't know what you're talking about....

[dreamster 0]

now whos teaseing,

[Deborah 0]

I'm hearing what you guys are saying about gluttony being a sin and I agree. We in the church shake our collective heads at drunks and smokers while increasing our waistlines gossiping at church potlucks, and this is not right. If it's okay, I'd like to add my three cents....

My sister in law had weight-loss surgery a few years back and I've seen firsthand how it has changed her life. She lived the first 50 years of her life obese and then morbidly obese. She has a thyroid imbalance and she tried many, many diet plans. Since her weight-loss surgery she has a new lease on life. She's not afraid to go places alone anymore, she smiles a lot more, she's trying new things like riding motorcycle. She joined a new church and has a passion for the Lord now. She likes herself more now too which makes it easier to be around her. It's been at least 5 years since her surgery and she's maintained a normal weight all this time.

Of course, this surgery is not without its risks--I know my sister in law got a kidney stone after her surgery and the surgery made kidney stones more likely to happen--but like many issues, a "yes" or a "no" is not a size-fits-all approach (pun intended, Dreamster).

One of my sister in law's daughters grew up when my sister in law was morbidly obese--this daughter is now obese herself. The other daughter has had a normal-sized mom for her teen and pre-teen years and has emulated the small-size portions her mother eats. That daughter is normal-sized (although in her early years wasn't) and is even competing today in a state track meet. I don't think this would be true if her mom had not had the weight-loss surgery.
-----------------------------------------------
Anybody who knows me knows how much I love animals. Two stray cats have adopted me--Sam and Hannah. Sam has a medical condition and he has to take a pill every day so his bladder doesn't get crystals in it. This medicine makes him less active, so he's an overweight cat, even though I carefully measure his special vet-prescribed food every day and he doesn't get any snacks. Hannah, on the other hand, eats more food, (the same type of food and snacks), and she is not fat.

It's been interesting to me to hear the mean things people say about Sam. They call him "Tubby" and other mean things and presume he is lazy and I am feeding him too much. My point? People are prone to rash judgments and can be very cruel to another who isn't "normal" sized. Let's be careful not to harshly judge one another, especially our brothers and sisters in Christ--if we had to walk in their shoes (or in this case, paws) we'd probably weigh more than they do.

[Linda Irish 0]

Nice to hear this side of the experience. It seems to have made a very good difference in this ladies life and the life of her daughter.thanks for sharing with us, I am enjoying this thread.

ps. I suffer from the thyroid issue so I can identify with Tubby......

[Deborah 0]

Sam here says he doesn't like to be called "Tubby" but he's sorry about your thyroid issue.

[lola21st 2]

Yes, I appreciated your story as well! The surgery has helped many who otherwise wouldn't have been able to lose the excess weight....

[lola21st 2]

Cholette -

Here are two more verses:

Jude 1:24
Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling, And to present you faultless before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy

Daniel 6:16
Your God, whom you serve continually, He will deliver you.

[dreamster 0]

hi debsta, if sam was on tv heed bea teletubby,, [british kids show,,eek]

[Deborah 0]

No presents for you, Scrooge Dreamster!

[Linda Irish 0]

we got tella tubbies here.....but me and Sam are still lickin our wounds and dont appreciate that kind of humor. :)

[dreamster 0]

,,i guess im again i jus do the best wiv the material im'' present-ed ''wiv, ,,,,,, D rides again,

[Linda Irish 0]

Dreamster, you are worth your weight in gold....and thats really really a lotta money I am sure!!!!!! :))

[dreamster 0]

talkin big mi sisda?? luki 4 me mi feelings not dented ,,but big of u 2 remind me, ,, um lets jus say im resonably well nourished,, ,,, ,,,,, D ,,,fiteing werld hunga ,,one meal atta time,,

[Deborah 0]

Linda Irish wrote:

we got tella tubbies here.....but me and Sam are still lickin our wounds and dont appreciate that kind of humor. :)

right on, Linda!

[dreamster 0]

,,,it wood seem cat has her tung ,,,,,,,,,,, D ,, takein a catnap,,

[Linda Irish 0]

I am kind of busy right now....can I get back with you in a bite?...I mean bit?

[dreamster 0]

sure,,i know distractg the drive thru can be,, D

[Linda Irish 0]

hahahaha you are a funny guy for real d.

[Cholette 0]

I really appreciate you all chiming in. I've been reading everyone's responses over the past days and just haven't had time to respond. Some really good things have been pointed out and I will share more in depth when I have more time.

Blessings!

[dreamster 0]

yep,, ,,,,,,,,, D ,,, werkg out at the gym

[UNLIMITEDLOVE 0]

Hi Cholette-

I actually had weight problems after my pregnancy. I am 5'9 and I use to weigh 135lbs but after my son I weighed 190lbs. I ate healthy and worked out for a whole year, because I have always enjoyed exercising. I had told the Lord that I really wanted to model, but I had gained so much wait! and the Lord told me, "you loose the weight and I'll do the rest." at the time I was attending school full-time and taking care of my son. I would wake up at 4 am in the morning to workout. Literally a whole year of sweat and tons of crying! eventually I lost most of the weight. However, I lost the weight and look pretty slender now, but I have the loose skin in my stomach. I did the sit-ups for six months, my stomach is flat but with loose skin, so now I want to get surgery. I believe it just depends on the person, and what the Lord personally says regarding the matter. The Lord as promised to provide money for my surgery, but I lost the weight with exercising and eating healthy not a quick way for a slimmer body, so it just depends.